Information

Welcome and introductions.

Attendees:
PFCC Danielle Stone (DS)
Marianne Kimani (MK)
Jonny Bugg (JB)
Vaughan Ashcroft (VA)
Paul Fell (PF)
Stuart McCartney (SMc)
ACFO Phil Pells (PP)
ACFO Jim Powell (JP)
Nick Alexander (NA)

Deborah Denton (DD) (Observer)

Minutes and decisions of previous meeting

The OPFCC Performance Director provided an update on the action relating to comparative data and explained how the figures were compiled.

 

PART 1

Secondary Fires

The Commissioner expressed her concern relating to the increase in secondary fires in the county and sought from the service if there had an understanding behind the increase and whether the fires were accidental or deliberate. ACFO Pells responded and provided the meeting with a briefing on secondary fires and noted that despite a lack of national data, the service were working on improving their information and understanding of these fires, stating that this was an area of focus for the service internal performance meeting. It was noted that there was a national increase in secondary fires but that when looking at the national data for all Fire and Rescue Services, Northamptopnshire was mid table. The Commissioner asked if work of the Arson Task Force was having an impact. ACFO Pells responded and noted that through their work, the service has good understanding of deliberate fires, which was why work was being undertaken to examine accidental fires along with public education and awareness campaigns.

The Commissioner then raised her concerns relating to ASB & young people and vulnerable people. ACFO Pells responded and explained work was ongoing with partners across the county. The Deputy PFCC asked what support the OFPCC could give the service in relation to the work being undertaken regarding secondary fires. ACFO Pells responded and noted that once the local data is analysed, that information will inform future decisions.

The OPFCC Performance Director asked for timescales on this work as it would help to inform awareness campaigns for summer 2026. ACFO Pells responded and noted the work will be completed before the end of March 2026. This included an assessment of the causal factors for these fires and then an assessment of whether prevention activity needed to change as a result.

ACTION – PF to follow up outside this meeting at the end of March for the results of this work

The Commissioner concluded the discussion by noting that future work relating to such matters should include the Local Area Partnerships.

Assurance Statement
The Commissioner had stressed that she was concerned over the apparent mid term increase in secondary fires, having asked about this previously. Her concern related to a number of factors including the demand increase, the fact that there was a risk this might adversly affect the service response to primary fires and whether the increase included deliberate fire setting.

She was assured that the county was not an outlier in this regard but still concerned in relation to the increasing number. She was reassured that the service were looking at this as an issue but following a detailed conversation stated that she wanted a timeline for the completion of this work to properly inform prevention activity for the expected summer seasonal peak in demand. It was agreed that this would be done by the end of March.

PART 2

2026-27 Draft Budget

Following the previous discussion relating to the draft budget, the Commissioner asked the service if they were confident to agree the final proposals. The Chief Finance Officer for Fire & Rescue responded and noted that the service had benefitted from a fairer funding settlement, but challenges remained.

The Commissioner asked the service how they would deliver the savings target as set out in the draft budget. The Chief Finance Officer for Fire responded and explained that a number of budget lines had been reviewed and removed from the final proposals along with a review of a number of contracts. The Commissioner asked about the cost of overtime and the impact of being over establishment. The Chief Finance Office for Fire responded and noted that the cost of overtime has reduced compared to 2021-22. The Commissioner was very concerned over the continued high overtime spend in the service.

The service then briefed the Commissioner on the work being undertaken on modelling in relation to appliance availability and how demand will be met through the CRMP. The Commissioner asked when this work will be completed as it was important to look at all options when updating the county’s MPs. The Commissioner expressed her frustration over the length of time that this modelling was taking and ACFO Powell stated that a contractor to undertake this activity had almost been appointed and it was suggested that this would be 16 weeks from that point, although he hoped it would be quicker. He also stated it was his intention to filter findings from this activity into a work programme as they emerged rather than wait till the end of the process. ACFO Powell agreed to provide an update for the timescales for this work as it was known.

ACTION ACFO Powell to provide a timeline for the agreed modelling work to PF once a contractor has been formally appointed.

The Commissioner than asked the service about income generation. ACFO Powell responded and used the work relating to training relating to electric car fires as an example of ongoing work which could also have an impact elsewhere in the service. The Commissioner then requested an update in relation to the new Welfare Pods and why delivery had taken so long, ACFO Powell responded and agreed to investigate the matter and update the Commissioner. The Commissioner also sought an update relating to fleet maintenance. ACFO Pells responded and the OPFCC Chief Finance Officer explained the costs and bureaucracy involved in delivering an inhouse solution.

ACTION – ACFO Powell to provide a date for delivery of the new welfare pods

The OPFCC Chief Finance Officer then explained that despite an increase in the budget available, it was important to review the MTFP to ensure it can best meet future demand. The Commissioner reiterated her frustration that the modelling work had not been completed as it would help inform the decision-making process. She also noted the need to include local communities and parish councils in future decisions. The meeting then agreed to sign off the final draft budget proposals with the proviso that the savings target contained within the budget can be delivered.

There was a discussion about the required savings in the region of £3M. It was explained that £1.4M had in principle been identified. VA requested that these be removed formally in the paper from budget lines so that they are not duplicated.

ACTION- – NA to formally remove the £1.4M identified savings from budget lines

ACFO Pells stated that the magnitude of savings needing to be made is likely to result o=in real term cuts. VA made the point that the service had already agreed new growth and that on behalf of the Commissioner the request was to review whether these new areas were still required before we looked at cuts in services. This was agreed.

Assurance Statement
The Commissioner expressed concerns on the level of savings that would likely be required to balance the budget and sought assurances from the Fire service that this was achievable in their plans.
She was conscious that significant work had gone into the budget paper presented to her, however.
She was concerned and frustrated at the lack of progress made on the modelling activity, especially as this had previously been undertaken as a part of the ECR work. She made it clear that her expectation was that this would be completed no later than 16 weeks after the contractor was appointed, which was imminent.
The Commissioner formally agreed the budget paper proposed to her, subject to the Chief Officer Team committing to and making the required saving as mentioned in the paper, noting that the budget settlement for the Chief Fire Officer was £5M more in 2026/27 than the previous year.

 

AOB

No further business was raised.